Mike B

Yep, it's just you . There is a link to the classified ads section on the left hand side near the top of the page, but here is a direct link to post an ad: http://www.datsunclassifieds.com/uploadproduct.php

Good luck with the sale. I guess we can look for ex-Z owners on 911s.com.

I recall there being an issue with the floors at least http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?34973-Give-it-to-me-straight....How-Bad. Too bad that the current ebay listing didn’t mention it at all Part of that is due to the ridiculously low value of the dollar these days, but yes, Datsun owners are a pretty cheap bunch in general.

There's no such thing as an OEM locking gas cap for an S30. However, JDM market cars came standard with locking gas doors (keyed to the same key as the other external locks) from the beginning of production. Other export market cars (UK, Australia, maybe others) also had them as standard equipment. -Mike

Yes, the seatbelt hooks should also be on the other side of the seat backs. If there are no holes on the other side of the seats, then they were either recovered and someone put them on other side, or the seats were disassembled and the hinges were put on the wrong sides. To make them correct again, you could remove the bolts that hold the seat backs in place and swap the sides, or you could remove and swap both sets of hinges. -Mike

You may want to swap the seats also. The tilt adjustment knobs should be facing the transmission tunnel, not the doors, so the seats are on the wrong side. Nice work though! -Mike

26thZ (Chris) started a thread about this 2 years ago http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?34565-Shin-Yoshikawa-Aluminum-S30-Chassis. It doesn't look like Shin's website has been updated since then (5/2009), so I wonder if he ever got past making the doors? -Mike

Maybe you didn't click on the right area or read down far enough? http://www.nissan-motorsports.com/ENN/NISSAN/HISTORY/Z/content01.html "On the other hand, the Z has also been popular among privateers in America where clubman race is popular. Pete Block the pro-Japanese (a Japanophile) bought a Datsun 240Z immediately upon its release. Bob Sharp who had been enjoying racing in Nissan cars also started entering competitions with a 240Z. The BRE 240Z, run by Block, overpowered the others with its high power and superior maneuverability. In 1970 and 1971, the car won the SCCA championship C Class 2 years running. Sharp also became the SCCA champion in 1972 and 1973, and even raced in the IMSA GT series in 1975. In the GTU class, he took 10 victories on his way to becoming champion. Later in the SCCA, the 260Z of Electramotive, established by the former engineers of BRE and the 280Z of Sharp, won the Production C class title in 1975. Later, the S30 type continued its performance of winning, taking the title until 1978. This S30 type performed well in Europe as well, and the first car to compete in 'Le Mans 24 Hours' was also the Z. In 1975, a local French team carried an S30 type 260Z to a result of 1st in its class. The car completed its run in 26th overall."

It's the lighting. My pictures were taken outside on a very sunny day. Adam's roadster also has the VTO's sold by BRE. He just doesn't run the center caps, since they aren't allowed on a track car. -Mike

Carl, Your fuel tank is correct for a car without the evap tank. They don't have the two upper hose connections on the front and back of the tank or the connection on the far left side. Here are some links to comparisons of the tanks from my 11/69 and 5/72 cars when I was refinishing them. http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?34476-Should-I-seal-my-gas-tanks&p=293178&viewfull=1#post293178 http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?34476-Should-I-seal-my-gas-tanks&p=293180&viewfull=1#post293180 -Mike

They are 205/60's actually.

I'd be interested to see more photos of the RHD conversion process. Did you swap out the entire cowl that you show in the photo above? How about the firewall sheet metal. Does it still have the HLS30 VIN or did you replace that part of the firewall with the HS30 VIN on the other side? -Mike

Yes, I am pretty certain that is the case, but I have never had it apart to confirm that. -Mike

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that BRE are also selling these VTO LeMans style wheels for the same price and they come with nice BRE logo center caps http://www.bre2.net/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=B&Product_Code=bre_datsun_lemans_bregray_wheel&Category_Code=bre_datsun_lemans_wheels. I got one of the first sets in late August (15x7, zero offset) and the Brocks' took some pictures of them on my blue car. I believe they planned to use them their website, or maybe a newsletter, but I haven't seen anything yet. I know they have been busy with other matters since then, so it may not be a high priority right now. Here is a photo I took with my cell photo during their photo shoot and a few more I took afterwards. I plan to use the wheels on my white car after I'm finished putting it back together. -Mike

Yes, I guess you could say you have struck a nerve. I get tired of seeing you bash the members on this site, and Z owners in general, for posting harmless comments. If you say I am one of the people that post offense “price bashing” posts, it must be true . Funny that I have never heard it from anyone else. Maybe you have let your moderator status go to your head and you think you need to implement your own guidelines about what people can and can’t post on this site? You’re fear-mongering attitude of “if anyone says anything negative or questions the price of a Z for sale it will devalue all our cars”, is just ridiculous to me. By the way, is there a bit of a different standard for you than the rest of us? Take a look at my comments in this thread or any other thread and compare them to yours in this one (post #11) http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?41262-1970-240z-Please-help-me!-thank-you&p=354376&viewfull=1#post354376 then let us know which is more “denigrating” as you put it (somehow I think you will still say it is me.) Once again, you overracted to IdahoKidd’s comments, which I interpret (yes my OPINION) to be a bit of a lighthearted comparison to his car for sale (white vs black interior), etc. And for the record Leonard, I do think your car is at least very reasonably priced and probably under priced (my OPINION only, if Escanlon will allow me to have one). I am surprised you haven’t had any interest yet, but like Arne had mentioned, the classifieds section on this site may be a good way to sell parts, but entire cars don’t seem to do as well for some reason. Ebay or craigslist may be a better way to attract more potential buyers. Uh, no one put me in charge of deciding “fair pricing” for Z’s, which is EXACTLY why I prefaced my comment with “To me…”. I guess that was lost on you. Yes, the pricing comments were my opinions. I try to keep with up ebay/craigslist pricing and TV auctions and car shows (what’s my car worth, etc…) on which to base my opinions, but I guess that is not allowed? I thought the purpose of a discussion forum, was to discuss our opinions, including pricing. I guess that is fine as long as they all agree with yours? Ok, so isn’t that basically the same opinion as what the original poster and I posted? So what are you basing YOUR valuation on if you admit you don’t watch any comparable recent sales? I would say my comment is accurate, and no more insulting than what I see you post to other members here on a regular basis. Exactly my point. If price is no object, ANY parts can be reproduced. The problem IS the size of the market. Set up costs are the bulk of the cost to manufacture something. If you only make a small number of parts, the per unit cost ends up being too high to sell enough to cover your costs, so they aren’t economically viable to make reproductions. What exactly is a “professional car judge”? I’ve been to the last two national Z conventions and meet most, if not all, the judges (even did a little bit of judging myself at one) and they are just regular Z people like anyone else. No one gets paid, so I am not sure that would qualify as much of “profession”. I think this site is pretty well moderated, by the other mods at least. I guess you feel differently and would like to see more of a crack down on comments that offend you somehow? So anyway, back to the rest of this thread…. FastWoman, your comparison of the Z to the Miata is right on. I think the early days of the Miata and the Z (S30) were very similar. Both were innovative reasonably priced sports cars with high initial demand and waiting lists to get one. Both were favorites of hobby and professional racers (the Miata still is). Both were produced in relatively high numbers. I think the Miata has actually been able to stay a lot closer to its original design and market niche than the Z has. The Z turned into an expensive, overly complex car and some models became more luxury/touring than sports oriented. I also wonder if the Miata will ever become collectable and people will restore them. I think they made several special edition versions that may hold their value better than others (although I think those were mostly paint and trim differences, but I could be wrong). I wonder if people will restore older model year Miatas when newer model years that still embody the original concept, but have been improved, can still be bought new or slightly used. We owned a 1990 Miata for a few years when we lived in Hawaii and it was a great car for that environment. Of course I had a 240Z then too, so it was a tough decision which to drive for the day. I also agree with the comments that the costs to restore any car are about the same. I think Z’s sell for similar prices as many base model V-6 muscle cars, at least ones that are in pretty good shape or restored to a fairly high level. Unfortunately, that may not be enough to cover the cost to get the car to that level. It’s generally only the very limited production/ high performance models that sell for big money. Well done restomods also seem to be a niche gaining in popularity and price, for both Z’s and muscle cars. The topic of survivor cars vs restored cars is also interesting. I’ve seen unrestored survivor cars sell for good prices on TV auctions. The only problem I see with owning one is if the value of it is due to being a low mileage all original survivor, it would be difficult to drive it without devaluing the car too much. With a restored car, you can always restore it again, if need be. -Mike

Escanlon, You post this same type of comment any time someone else comments about a Z car for sale. If you think $38,750 is such a great deal for the car, hit the buy-it-now button. In a prior thread about this same car, it was noted that the current owner recently bought it from the original owner for $14K. To me that means the seller is asking a lot more than the car than it is really worth, or the prior owner got a really bad deal, or maybe a bit of both. If the seller was asking $14k to $20K for it, I bet the car would have sold by now and people would think it was a fair price for a nice car. If you really think "the most vehement posts denigrating higher pricing for ANY Z, come from other Z owners" you haven't spent much time looking at other sites, like bring-a-trailer.com, not just when Z cars are being sold, but ANY car listed for sale. The whole idea that comments on this site about specific cars and opinions about their worth brings down the value of Z cars is naive at best. Value is what someone will actually pay, based on supply and demand, not based on what opinions are posted on a website. Maybe I'll start posting that I think 1967 big bock Corvettes are worthless on a Corvette site, so I can get one for next to nothing . Whether you like it or not, there is still a large supply of Z cars in the US, relative to the demand. Most Americans value the big boat US made muscle cars they and their families grew up with. Even then, the really high prices only go to cars that are very limited production high performance models. Since most Z cars sold in the US only had few, if any, factory options and no factory high performance models were sold here, that will always limit their appeal and value to the masses, in my opinion. I own 240Zs because I like them, not because I consider them a good investment. Your comment about scaring off people wanting to make replacement parts is equally off base. People make replacement parts because they think they can make some money on them, which means they have to sell a relatively large number of parts. People make reproduction parts for muscle cars because there are a TON of them. There were so many variations in Z parts over the years it is tough to find many parts that are correct for a large number of cars. Given the small size of the market, it's really hard to make a quality part that can be sold for a reasonable price. THAT is why so few are made. Anyway, that is my 2 cents. FWIW -Mike

Sort of... he joined the site and made one post after the Griot's catalog photos were taken during a Peter Brock hosted event at Griots last December http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?40540-Caffeine-and-Gasoline-with-Pete-Brock&p=346094 Finally! Carl's Z history source revealed.... a car care products catalog . -Mike

It's a series one 240Z shell with an RB26DETT N1 (2.6L twin turbo dual overhead cam engine) that is planned to be installed. It was recently listed on ebay and bid up to $60K, but didn't meet the reserve http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120704418733&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT. The BIN was $69K. I believe the shell came from a member of this site that kept the upgraded (non-original) engine and sold the shell to this guy. From Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_RB_engine: The RB26DETT N1 is a modified version of the RB26DETT engine, developed by Nismo (Nissan Motorsports) for Group A and Group N motorsport. Nismo found that the standard RB26DETT engine required too much maintenance for use in a Group-A or Group-N race car and consequently designed the N1 block. This was first used in Bathurst Australia. Nismo balanced the crankshaft to a higher specification than stock, as the RB26DETT engine experiences vibrations between 7000 and 8000 rpm. The engine also received improved water and oil channels within the engine block. The pistons and top piston rings were also upgraded to 1.2 mm. The N1 engine also has upgraded camshafts and upgraded turbochargers. Although all versions of the RB26DETT N1 engine use Garrett T25 turbochargers, the specification of the turbochargers changed through the 3 generations of the RB26DETT N1 engine (R32, R33, and R34). The R32, and R33 versions used Journal Bearing T25 Turbochargers. The R34 RB26DETT N1 engine used Garrett GT25 turbo chargers (which use a Ball Bearing). The biggest difference between the turbochargers used in the N1 engine, and the standard RB26DETT engine, is that the Turbine Wheels in the turbocharger are made from Steel, rather than the Ceramic used for the Standard RB26DETT turbochargers. The Ceramic turbine wheels are found to be very unreliable when used at high rotational speeds inducing higher centrifugal forces (such as when the turbochargers are used at a higher boost pressure than stock). With the advances in manufacturing technology such as sealing and material processes, the N1 engine is theoretically said to be able to produce in excess of 1,900 bhp (1,400 kW) The Nismo RB26DETT N1 Engine Block uses an 86 mm bore which can be bored up to either 87 mm or 88 mm. The N1 block is stamped with an identification mark of 24U, whereas the standard RB26DETT block is marked with 05U. The RB26DETT N1 block is compatible with all GT-R engine bays. Only two R32 GTR Bathurst cars were stripped after the competition. Parts were shipped back to Japan where it's believed some were sold to private parties in New Zealand and Australia. -Mike

I was looking through some old pictures and noticed that I had saved photos of a French language version of the first brochure that I posted about. Google translator says "En grande vitesse avec la Datsun 240Z" means "Into high gear with the Datsun 240Z". No French translation for "Groove with it" I guess . -Mike

Ok, if your CNC engraver can make it with the Datsun red, white, and blue emblem on the left side, its a deal . Well to me a "customer ordered production model" would be a custom order, so I am not sure I see much a difference there. -Mike

Funny, I didn't even notice that. Maybe it was made by Nissan USA, since we don't spell so good here . -Mike

There is a 1977 280Z on ebay now that says it is a "ZZZAP" special edition with a decal delete http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Datsun-Z-Series-77-280Z-ZZZAP-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem3cb6b12345QQitemZ260763099973QQptZUSQ5fCarsQ5fTrucks#v4-39. To me that just makes it a 411 Sun Yellow 280Z, but the interesting thing is it has what looks to be a customized plaque on the console that says: 1977 Datsun 280-Z HLS30 385188 Customer Order Production Model For Sam S. Melnick Nissan Motor Co., LTD. Yokohama, Japan April 1977 I've never seen a plaque like that before on any S30, but it looks like it could be authentic. I didn't think any US market S30s could be custom ordered. I thought the dealers pretty much had to sell whatever the factory produced. Customers could put a deposit down and request certain specific colors/options (5 speed, air conditioning, etc) but had to wait to until the dealer had one arrive or could trade another dealership for a specific car. Has any one else seen one of these plaques before? -Mike

North American 240Zs were made in 907 Racing Green with either black or brown (tan) interiors from the beginning. There was no running out of tan parts and substituting black. Here is a copy of the paint and interior options from the 1970 Nissan Service Bulletin introducing the 240Z. -Mike

Thanks for sharing the new photos Kats. I am glad your 240Z is safe and I hope your family is doing ok too. -Mike

Well, originally we were discussing what the VIN of 240Z at the 1970 Chicago Auto Show could be and since the show started Feb 21, 1970, I think it would have to have been a car produced no later than Jan 1970 (if not Dec 1969). Then you stated that "by March of 1970 the first couple thousand Datsun 240Z's had arrived in the U.S". Now you've clarified that means at least 2,000 in the US by March 1970, which I still doubt. No, Carl, those were production cumulative totals I listed, not how many were produced each month. I was trying to save you from having to do any math, but I guess that didn't work . At the end of Feb 1970 there were a total of 2,061 export S30's that had been produced. In addition to the Canadian cars, weren't there some RHD export cars produced by then too? Your Zhome.com site lists these production numbers for 1970: US 16,215 (91%); Canada 1,201 (7%); Australia 319 (2%). I calculated the percentages based on the total of those numbers. If we apply those percentages to the 2,061 export production total as of Feb 1970 that would be approximately: US 1,884; Canada 140; Australia 37. Based on those numbers, the delays I mentioned previously, and the actual sales dates shown below, it seems very unlikely that 2,000 cars would have been sold in the US by March 1970. No Carl, I don't believe that the cars were delivered to dealers and sold in sequential order, although with all the confusion about the "first boat load" of cars to the US and the "first car sold to the public" that I have seen posted I can understand why some people could think that. That is good to hear. Next time the "first car sold to the public" discussion comes up you can help dispel it. I complied a list of 240Z production and sales dates from your public zhome.com original owners registry, public posts by owners, and sales/registration documents that I have seen. I am sure it is not as complete as the data you have in your private database, but it is the best I can do. If you want to post some numbers that would help support your claim that 2,000 or more 240Zs were sold in the US by March 1970 I would be interested in seeing it. -Mike