DeesZ

Lesson learned: I should have checked here first. My head is hung low and my tail is between my legs. I picked up a really nice E88 head the other day. I was checking the torque for the cam towers. I couldn't find specs in the FSM, so I checked Tom Monroe book "How to Rebuild..." and found the torque listed at 33 ft-lb. Need I say more? Well the first one snapped the bolt; I guess I am fortunate that it didn't strip the head. Of course, now a search here tells me that 15 ft-lbs would have been much more proper. The other bolts were much tighter than 15 ft-lb, too, so I backed them off and retorqued to 15 ft-lb. Like I said - should have checked here first - I know. I feel bad. Anyway, bottom line here, is the head salvageable? What do you think, will a good machine shop pull me out of this mess or is this head sunk? Thanks for your help and advice. John p.s. I guess I gotta also ask; to what degree is the Monroe book in error? Is this the only bad info in there and I was lucky enough to find it and dumb enough to believe it.... or should I discount it as a reference?

Is this the reason for high fuel prices over the last several years?

Interesting information on carbs and dates of manufacture! my original suggestion of conversion date was based on some information in an old parts manual that I have and the cars I'm most familiar with. This leads me to wonder if "destination" had some bearing on it....(e.g. California cars may have required more smog stuff earlier...?) or maybe they just used up existing supplies of carbs they had on hand. I guess I should search the archive for the definitive answer, but that must come later as I have too much to do before I must leave for work at 6:00 a.m. Thanks for the information, folks. This is a great community.

I think flat-tops were introduced on July 1972 mfg. date (usually called a '73 here in the USA). Mine is a 05/72 mfg with round-tops. Another one I am parting out is a 11/72 (HLS30-132???) with flat-tops.

I don't know too much about this issue, but have run into it from another perspective. I bought an alternator for the conversion to an internal regulator (for my '72 240Z). I received one, a Hitachi, that looked just right except for this strange "extra" wire on the back. A friend of mine had at that time some way to connect with Hitachi, so he inquired about it with one of their service representatives, sending them pictures, etc... Seems that it was a "deep cycle" unit used for RV and marine purposes. I was told that it is a very expensive unit, but not to use it for my needs because bad bad things were likely to happen not having the deep cycle circuit and additional battery to handle the output. My friend told me that when the Hitachi rep saw the pictures the first statement was "Where the heck did you get that? They are a very limited distribution unit!" So, I assume to do this properly with two batteries, a special deep cycle alternator would be needed. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong..... like I said, I know very little about this, except what was passed to me from a Hitachi representative, but If anyone needs one of these alternators, I still have it on the shelf. I'm told that it is a several-hundred dollar unit... yours for what I got in it - $70.00 + shipping. I'll provide pictures if anyone wishes. Let me know if interested.

Yes, but read on..... "The headliner is nearly perfect." On the serious side, with this one at least the buyer has a fairly good indication of the actual condition. We've all seen some likely worse than this that have been disguised to look like new...... but six months later you've got one that looks like this.

I honestly see so much "difference" that I see no competition at all. I enjoy both sites for what each offers. I spend more time here, but am not a stranger over there, either. Loss of either one would not please me. Is there a way each could better promote the other? The Z-community needs both IMHO.

The upgrade is very simple.... even I could do it! You can find details at: http://www.classiczcars.com/reviews/showproduct.php?product=11&cat=7 As for the origin of the problem, I would be tempted to swap out the external voltage reg. I have had some over the years that "tested" well, but didn't "perform" well in the long run. But if you do the upgrade, you remove the external reg. anyway. I'm electrically challenged, so I'm sure others may have some good advice about the origin of your issues.

hls30.com IMHO has summed it up well with this statement: "One of the most strikeing things about the 240Z is the only other car with a similar profile is another S30!" The question is "How do I feel about the recent Z's?" Personally, I think that they get lost in the crowd. In my view (old-fashioned by some standards, but I am not required to give it up) the newer cars all look alike. You can tell the difference between "classes" of cars, but within them, to me, they are indistinguishable. What made the S30 desirable to me was in part the fact that there was no way to visually confuse it with anything else, and I found that very appealing. That fact remains to this day. The first 240Z that I touched I bought. In mid '72 a guy brought his '72 in for service one day where I worked..... by the end of the day, due to some funny circumstances, I owned the car. That was about 35 years ago, and I still remember it as if it was last week (and that's saying something for a 55 year old mind - well, my 55 year old mind anyway). Prior to that experience I turned my nose up at the 240Z.... I was in the foreign car parts business and drove a string of British vehicles, 100-6's, XKE's, 3000's, TR3's etc. God forbid that a Japanese vehicle even enter the ring for a shot at being a contender. But as they say "never say never".....For me it was a mechanical version of 'love at first sight'. As soon as I touched it I liked it. As soon as I drove it, I had to have it. It was a combination of several simple things working in combination: striking appearance, performance, simplicity, and affordability. Odd, that's what I looked for in women, too. Well, I've made big mistakes with women, but the 240Z was the final word when it came to cars. My passion for the '70 ~ 73 Z has not changed. For me, everything that followed somehow betrayed the basic fundamentals that the early Z cars laid as a foundation. Those changes that I did not like were probably driven mostly by two basic needs the decision makers at Nissan felt compelled to satisfy; the need to meet emission regulations, and the need to satisfy the buyer. So call me a stick in the mud, not open to new ideas, etc. Maybe I am, but I'm more than happy with the '72 240Z that I own. To me it is still striking in appearance, simple to maintain, a good performer, and still affordable. I cannot ask for any more to satisfy my simple needs. Two of the few changes that I would make and liked were the introduction of the turbo and the five-speed transmission. If my numbers weren't matching, I'd swap in those two items in a heartbeat. Now, that being said, keep in mind that it's a good thing that we all do not agree on the same things. If we did, the supply of these things would not meet the demands. Therefore, I'm glad that we do not all agree. Nor will I slight anyone for feeling the same way about another version of the vehicle, as it meets their wants just like mine does my needs. Unfortunately due to safety regulations, emissions standards, etc. for me the ideal car could not be legally produced. My request of Nissan would be to break out the old molds for the 240Z body and put a de-smogged l24 with an option to upgrade to a state-of-the-art power plant. Knowing that that request can't be satisfied, I suggest Nissan work on a design that stands out from the crowd. It's a risk, but it has worked for them before. Even going "retro" to a classic Z-Car appearance would set them apart today. Give up on the aerodynamic drive to make everything resemble an egg. We know an egg is "nature's perfect shape", but cars are of man, not Mother Nature. A portion of the buying public would sacrifice a few MPGs for a real "looker". Life is all about trade-offs anyway, isn't it? (Well, for the common man, anyway.) Thanks for entertaining my long-winded opinion.

The attached picture should do the trick for you.

My opinion (and others may not share it) is the standard NGK BP6ES or BPR6ES for an L24 engine. I have tried many brands. Back in the '70s I sold foreign car parts and drove a 240Z ('72). Nothing on the shelf performed better than the NGK. Believe me, I tried them all several times. The sales reps would give us anything we wanted for our cars in hopes that we would like it and make recommendations. (I wish I had that arrangement today!) Most other brands of plugs fouled quickly. I recall Champion being the worst, Bosch not good, and most others not suitable in comparison to the NGK. I will also add that NGK brand often failed miserably in other applications where Champion was the top recommendation. I had a 100-6 Healey that ate NGKs for breakfast, but Champions lasted forever a very long time. So, NGK is not a magic solution to all applications, but you can be confident that your results in an L24 should be more than satisfactory. The last Z I got had Bosch platinum plugs put in it just before I took posession. They were soon (350 miles or so) replaced by BPR6ES NGKs. Performance improved. As for wires, the NGK wires are tough to beat, but if you want to see thicker wires you'll have to pay a premium price. Back in the day we would also replace coils with a "high performance" unit. Lucas and Bosch units were hot at the time. I think most performance improvement was imagined wishful thinking - on my part, anyway. The 240Z L24 was fairly high-performance from the git-go in my opinion. One thing I have actually noticed a measurable improvement in performance and starting - a Pertronix ignition kit. If you are traveling far with other plugs, just put a six pack of NGKs under the seat; when you need them you got them. Don't forget a few tools, too. (There is a good thread on what tools to carry in the archives; well worth reading if you haven't already.)

Does anyone have a good picture of these brackets for the 240Z? I have boxes of Z parts in the garage and may be able to find a set or two if I know what they look like. Did the engines come with the brackets mounted from the factory? I seem to recall that my first 240Z (1972) had them originally, but they got discarded probably when I did my first valve adjustment back around '73. (...or I could be remembering the brackets on one of my old Jeeps? They say that the memory is the first thing to go.)

Bobc, I agree about keeping the ownership option open if possible, but I fully understand the concept of not being able to do so. There is also sometimes that certain 'something' about completing a project and moving on.... the answer to the question "What's next?" is different for each one of us to some degree or another. For my mid-life crisis I bought a Z, but to each his / her own. As for the "purist" who had comments, he may know his Zs, but doesn't know when to reserve comment. The latter is much more important in the grand scheme of things in life. I hope the Z finds a good home. (Wish it was my home, but that can't be so.)

I recently helped a friend through an alternator upgrade. Four trips to the parts store is what it took. It seems that the rebuilder incorrectly identified or boxed a batch. The correct one will fit. Oddly (maybe not) the retailer did not want the incorrect units back..... Anyone need a Hitachi "deep cycle" for their boat or RV? Nice $250.00 unit if someone could determine the application.

Great! I hope that resolves your issues. Please let us know. Electronics and their performance can be impacted by the temperature, and they can be intermittent. I'm not very knowledgable in that area, but I have learned that electronic gremlins are some of the worst to hunt down and eliminate. Sometimes the old trial and error method is the only alternative we have available, and since you've eliminated so much so far, I think you are about to crack the case.

I just read this thread again and in my mind keep coming back to the voltage regulator. My car - 1972 with external regulator (at that time) - had almost identical symptoms, including a strange intermittent sound sometimes under the hood. I cleaned all grounds (twice), checked the wires for soundness, etc.... had the VR & alternator checked, and everything passed with flying colors. Basically I feel like I've been on the same path. Everything I did in the end left me with the same intermittent symptoms of wide and abrupt charge / discharge fluctuations, and sometimes that strange sound. After each attempt at a fix, I imagined it to be a bit better, but honestly, in hindsight it was wishful thinking. Finally, one evening at dusk while out for a ride with the parking lights on, the pimple came to a head and popped. I had just hit a 55 mph stretch with a ricer in front of me, so I contemplated passing (the mad bee sound was annoying me). I noticed the ammeter do it's "charge" thing and didn't think much about it, but then it was the Twilight Zone. I dropped down a gear to dispatch the ricer, and the car sputtered while at the same time every light in the dash (remember they were on) got brighter than any dash light ever should. So, I'm sputtering & glowing now, and smoke is coming out of the dash. There was a pull off on the other side of the road, so I swung across and got stopped. Smoke, dash and console (fuse box) now, and the sputtering stopped when the engine died. Now, after making sure I had no flames, there was absolutely nothing - no lights, no starter, no nothing except a lot of hot wires. I had a friend help me drag her home and pushed her in the garage. The next day I investigated. As suspected, a fried fusible link at the starter - really toast. My friend and I concluded that a new VR was appropriate after installing a new f-link and having the ammeter peg itself on charge right out of the shoot. Got a new one the next day and replaced it. Problem basically solved, except for that intermittent strange sound which sometimes sounded like I had a blower on the old l24 (actually kinda cool, but indicative if an issue). The new external reg was much better than the last, but the intermittent sound, etc, got me off my duff to dig in my pile of parts for an alternator. I had one off of an old 280Z that once lived here, but it had an internal VR. So I did what I was tempted to do and got one of the plugs with diode and got rid of the old external VR when I put in the replacement alternator. Sweet results. For some reason those internally regulated units are superior. Not a problem since. Got a few extra amps from the replacement alternator to boot. So, what I learned here is that all along I had a faulty (intermittently so) external VR, and an alternator that liked to make sounds when it had to really work. Oh, yeah, I was quite lucky, too; the fried link incident burnt out or exploded (yes, in the truest use of the term, "exploded") every light bulb in my car that was on at the time (except one lonely dash light at the speedometer). That explained the Twilight Zone effects. Rod Serling would have been proud. To sum up, the VR and alt checked out fine on the bench, but in use there was a different story to be told. I'd swap in another known-to-be-good alternator and VR to see if your problem will be resolved that way. A worst case scenario is that you still have the problem and that wasn't it. But if it is, there is high potential to loosing your baby to a fire, or at least replacing fried electrical components. Sorry this went so long, but I felt I had to share before another Z gets fried. Please keep us posted. John

I agree with 240znz, likely a sender issue with the pressure. Just wondering, how did the pressure read before the rebuild? Do you have any way of finding that out? Assuming the sender wasn't changed out, your pressure should be about the same or better than it was. (Of course that also depends on what was wrong that required a rebuild in the first place.) I'd consider speaking with the rebuilder now, not later. Get your issues documented real early, and see what the expectations are supposed to be for you (like am I to 'expect' the blue smoke for a period, should the oil he put in it be changed out at a specific time, etc.) Do you have any documentation related to what was done for this rebuild (top end w/ valve seals, bottom end, both)? Has the engine been run at all since the rebuild, or is your start-up the first since the work? Just curious, what oil are you running now? Also, is there any loss of coolant? I hope this works its way out favirably for you.

Nice, very nice! Your results thus far are encouraging me to do the same. I must now think about what the color will be..... I was really in love with Arne's yellow.... I am partial to the red (the color of my first Z, a '72), or keep it what it was, white. Decisions, decisions. Must address some rust first, so there is no rush to decide. John

I agree, Motorsport is careful with their shipments. I have had an issue or two with them, but they made everything right with no additional cost to me. Here's one example: My wife ordered a cup holder for me from them. She mistakenly ordered one for a 350Z. Of course it wouldn't fit so it had to go back. Now here is an example of good customer service (and why I keep doing business with them)...... She called and explained the problem. First she got an aploogy, something like "we are very sorry. We know that he always orders for an early 240Z. It is our fault for not asking." Next was great too...."We will send a pick-up slip and a proper replacement immediately." Two days later my UPS man picked up the wrong part, and the enxt day I had the correct one in hand. Not another penny out of my pocket. Consider contacting VB and see what they will do to "make things right" for you. If they are not willing to do so, I'd tell them that they have an opportunity in front of them to make a loyal customer or to loose your future purchases and those of other folks (fellow forum readers). What do you have to loose? There is nothing like good customer service! I am interested to see how you make out with that. I suspect some other forum readers are too. Please keep us posted on this.

Here are a few pictures of an old externally regulated alternator on my '72 (prior to making an upgrade to an internally regulated unit). You'll note that the external regulator has been removed, but the pictures were taken prior to removing the old alternator.

If you buy one in USA, your location, Toronto, means that you'd be importing from USA into Canada. Does that mean that you would be subject to import duties/taxes? I sold a car (on eBay) to a guy in Canada not long ago and he backed out of the deal. His story was that the import taxes were too much of a burden and that he wished he knew about that issue before he bid. Is this true? If so, it may be very beneficial to buy in Canada, or perhaps skirt the taxes by buying a 'shell'. I don't know what the regulations are, but it may be worth considering.

Loopks like the PO was a furnace repairman and installed a "restart" switch! Wouldn't that be sweet! The car fails, you hit the button and all is well again... Where can I get one of those? (It'd be great for life in general!)