Big Sam

[halz]

A while back one of our UK friends chimed into another thread with a note about the historic British Z known as "Big Sam". I think he was the current owner of the car..or at least someone very well acquainted with the car.

Who was that person? Is there more information at this site on "Big Sam?" (I've searched, but there's not much) I'm interested in finding out more about its technical spec... please help!

[abas]

quite a lot of info on Big Sam at www.zhome.com including technical specs. Click on the picture of Big Sam on the home page to get to the menus.

Andrew

[26th-Z]

Hi Halz and Andrew,

There is an excellent description of Big Sam and her (its) history in Brian Long's book; "Datsun Z - Fairlady to 280Z". Page 133. I really encourage everyone to get this book and read it. I find it to be one of the best references with many pictures and very thorough descriptions. In its initial configuration, Big Sam put out 245bhp at 7200 rpm. Triple Delorato 48mm carburetors were used. Big Sam won the 1974 Blue Circle Modsports Championship - the first car outside Japan and the USA to win a championship. Big Sam has a history of chassis replacement as a result of racing accidents and the current car is not the initial car. However, it is my understanding that the current chassis comes from works rally history.

How are the seat corner guards coming, Andrew? I have another photo of them (although not a great one) and I got to touch kats'. We should talk more as I am determined to have them and I really have little hope of finding them original.

[abas]

Originally posted by 26th-Z

How are the seat corner guards coming, Andrew? I have another photo of them (although not a great one) and I got to touch kats'. We should talk more as I am determined to have them and I really have little hope of finding them original.

Chris

Having visited a couple of shows recently and met up with some zedheads local to me, I've got up a real head of steam over here to get my car running this summer and so other non-essential items have taken a back seat. I'm sure you had a great time at the convention. I saw your photo standing next to Mr K: if that smile had been any bigger your head would have split in two:classic:

Now that you have seen them up close, do those seat guards have a smooth texture or a crinkle texture similar to the dash? I can't promise I will be able to replicate the texture anyway.

Apologies to Halz for screwing up his thread:stupid:

[halz]

Thanks for that guys, its been a while since I've read that history. I was hoping that there might be a more recent update somewhere..?

One interesting point that I noted was..

"rebuilt as one of Spikeís "trick" 260 units (240Z crank, 280Z bore 2.6 litre short stroke)."

I've often daydreamed that this combination would give a 'better' 2.6litre engine than the stock 260Z.

Also interesting to note that the Samuri guys were able to achieve over 200bhp quite comfortably using an L24 as the base engine...no need for a big bore job, so forget your L28 build ups!

[HS30-H]

Originally posted by halz

......Also interesting to note that the Samuri guys were able to achieve over 200bhp quite comfortably using an L24 as the base engine...no need for a big bore job, so forget your L28 build ups!

Nissan achieved more than 200 BHP themselves on all of the Works rally cars which used the L24 engine block, and in fact its fairly simple to get this kind of power. Nothing much to do with 'Samuri' there, especially as the cars we know as "Big Sam" started out with what were - essentially - Works rally car engines.

The currently fitted engine is not a Spike Anderson-built unit, and does not utilise an L24 crankshaft. Tim Riley has to take credit for the car's current build and preparation, which is to an excellent standard - like most of his work. He's living and working in New Zealand at present.

[kmack]

Originally posted by HS30-H

Nissan achieved more than 200 BHP themselves on all of the Works rally cars which used the L24 engine block, and in fact its fairly simple to get this kind of power.

And.....? Please continue this topic. I have an L28 waiting in the wings to become my 200hp engine, but if I can get it from the L24, then all the better. As it stands, I'm already pushing 139hp at the wheels with my original L24 w/ E31 head. That puts my crank output somewhere in the neighborhood of around 165 hp!

How do I get more?

[halz]

...I'm already pushing 139hp at the wheels with my original L24 w/ E31 head

Kmack, that sounds like my own setup although its in an 'as recieved' state - I've yet to do anything more serious than change the oil and plugs! Maybe you could start another thread and tell me what work you've done to your L24/E31 engine to achieve 139bhp at the wheels...

Alan, I read that Big Sam (and its variants) was making over 260bhp at times, presumably using the standard 2.4 litre dimensions but with special internal components. The reason I said 'over 200bhp' was because 200bhp from an L24 would be per-lenty for this Z-layman!

Do you know where we can go for or an update on Big Sam?

[26th-Z]

More from Brian Long in his description of the 1974 season; "In a season full of incidents, it was decided to rebuild the engine to a higher specification. A forged crankshaft was purchased from Gordon Allen, there were Carello conrods, domed pistons giving 11:1 compression ratio, and a special camshaft from Peter Brock. Power output was boosted to around 250bhp at 8000rpm".

[HS30-H]

Originally posted by halz

Do you know where we can go for or an update on Big Sam?

Hi halz,

Maybe the best thing to do would be to contact the owner - Nick Howell. He is a member of this forum and has the username "Nick H".

I'm afraid that there is nothing on the web - to my knowledge - that gives current or completely accurate information on the car. That's why it would be best to ask Nick himself.

I'm afraid that much of the published historical information about the car ( or more accurately, cars plural ) conflicts in detail. It can be very confusing and somewhat annoying. For example, the second bodyshell used on the car ( that's the current bodyshell ) has often been described as being the car that Shekhar Mehta used on the 1972 Safari Rally. Unfortunately, this is impossible as that car ( carnet registration number "TKS 33 SA 4540" ) was RHD and the current shell used on "Big Sam" was originally LHD, and only converted to RHD after it was acquired by Bob Gathercole. The car actually has an "HLS30" ( ie LHD ) VIN prefix. They cannot be the same shell.

The formerly used bodyshell ( that of Rauno Aaltonen's 1970 RAC Rally Works entry ) has been described as having the VIN prefix "HS30LW" ( the "LW" part - supposedly - standing for "Light Weight" ), which is total bollocks of course. The VIN prefix on that car was just "HS30"..........

Nick has been digging into the history and intrigue of the car lately, and I've been corresponding with him about it. I think I have a very good idea about what the current bodyshell's last two events in Works hands were, but I'll leave it to Nick to update interested parties on that - as its his car.

It would be refreshing to see an accurate and properly researched history of the car ( cars ) published one day. It certainly deserves it.

Alan T.

[kmack]

Originally posted by halz

Kmack, that sounds like my own setup although its in an 'as recieved' state - I've yet to do anything more serious than change the oil and plugs! Maybe you could start another thread and tell me what work you've done to your L24/E31 engine to achieve 139bhp at the wheels...

My engine info has been documented in the following thread:

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10733&highlight=dyno

But here's a quick run-down:

Original L24 block (1971)

stock bore

stock pistons

new rings

new seals

new gaskets

FelPro head gasket

E31 head (unmodified)

stock cam

stock oil pump

6-2-1 headers into a 2-1/4" exhaust with turbo muffler

'71 SU's w/ K&N filter in stock airbox

stock needles and nozzles (currently sure what number needles are in there, but they are the ones that came with the car when I got it.)

With the airbox in place, I pulled 136 hp at the wheels. I pulled 139.2 hp at the wheels with the airbox removed. And I was still running rich. Estimated compression is 9.5:1

[Nick H]

What did people want to know about Big Sam? As a race car it is obviously updated and tuned from time to time so a lot of "published"data is old and no longer relevent.

At the moment Sam is sitting in my garage doing....nothing. Last time out was last year in a couple of local sprints here in Cornwall. Tifle embarrasing as the car is not set up for bumpy tamac, cracked concrete and occasional grass but it was a fun couple of days and there were many compliments about how magificent it sounded, how good it looked and gosh ..is it the real Sam etc etc. Absolutley no comments about the driver's (lack of) skills, which is perhaps a good thing.

The main advantage that Sam has had over its, often more powerful, rivals has been its handling. As an ex-works car it has a very stiff bodyshell and further stiffening, together with some careful suspension tuning it has a very balanced---within 300gms--- set up when a 12 stone driver is aboard.

It is all about handling and brakes; and a good driver of course. I'm not particularly good--eight seconds a lap down on Win Percy who was marvellous and SO pleased about being in Sam again and so complimentary about the handling."Nothing like it used to be" he said! It is tragic that the back operation that he had last year has paralysed him. He may get back racing again but I doubt that it will be in Sam.

Nick Howell