Have a few questions about my 240

[Jonu]

First of all, I finally got a 240Z a couple days agao and am pretty excited to get started on it. It currently doesn't run, so that is first on my list of priorities. It hasn't been driven in years (last inspection sticker/plate was in '07) and so I'm not to interested in trying to go out and turn it over just yet. What I'm considering doing is buying the Fel-Pro gasket kit from summit racing http://www.summitracing.com/parts/FEL-FS21157PT/Application/?prefilter=1 so i can replace all the gaskets and seals. I also got a bunch of spare parts to go with it and one of the items is an E88 head from a 260Z. I was wanting to practice setting the valve clearances on this head but can't figure out how to turn the cam w/o it being attached to anything. I'm also looking for opinions on what else I should do before attempting to start the engine, this is how my list stands at the moment (it was running before the guy quit driving it):

1. Replace all gaskets and seals

2. Pull apart carbs, clean and reassemble

3. Clean up the Dizzy and verify that it is in spec

4. Drain fuel from lines and tank

5. Verify that the valve train is in spec

6. Fab up new fuel lines? I assume i should do this since the lines in there are probably closing in on 40 years of service

7. Drain and replace all fluids

Anything I missed from that list? I'm thinking of buying a second bare block and sending it out to get rebuilt along with the spare head, intake, and carbs that I have. Then get the original block rebuilt to stock specs since it is the original block.

[72 OJ]

Good luck and welcome to Z LAND,here you will find a vast store of knowledge, plus a bunch of Z nuts who share info, visit the old threads , there are answers in abundance ........

Edited April 21, 2012 by 72 OJ

[d240zx2]

Search for a subject called "awakening the sleeping beast," or similar. You will find in that thread a thorough and complete list of things to do, in which order and in some cases, how to do them. I'd do that before even washing the car.

[olzed]

To turn the cam with the head removed you can put a wrench on an area of the cam that has a couple of flats cast on it.

If the cam lobes are rusty, don't turn the camshaft.

Are you saying you want to change all the engine gaskets and you havn't had the engine running yet. Why? Is there evidence of oil leaks.? There may be no oil leaks.

Before ripping out fuel lines to replace them,you need to first verify if they are indeed rusty on the inside surfaces. They may be fine.

[Carl Beck]

Hello Jonu

Welcome to the group. It would help if you gave us some idea as to what use you plan to put your 240Z to. Said another way - do you plan to actually "Restore" it, or just "Refresh" it, or do a complete Street Mod. to it. Once you start down any path - it can cost a lot of money to change your mind later.

it would also be helpful if we knew how much room you have to work on the car, how well equipped your Tool Box is etc. As well as what time frame you have in mind - is this a one year project or are you thinking of 90 days etc.?

If you want the best advice here - you have to provide the best possible information on your end.

First Read this thread: It will answer a lot of your initial questions

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?22619-Waking-the-sleeping-beast

Second:

Read the information about the E31 and E88 L series heads here:

http://www.zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/E31andE88Heads.htm

If you actually have an E88 off a 260Z, you may not want to use it. Unless you plan extensive modifications for performance. The E88's that came on the 260Z's were "emissions" heads - not performance heads.

Third:

It would be a lot more useful if you can Post some clear detailed pictures of the car and its component parts. We would have to see things like the fuel lines, overall condition of the engine compartment etc - to really give you sound advice.

I've never had to replace the metal fuel lines on a 240Z - but then my Z's have always been in "low rust" States/Area's. If the car spent time in the Great Lakes Area of the Country or in the North East.. you may have major rust problems.

Fourth:

I can't see any reason to overhaul a non-matching number L24 - for a 240Z. Even if you got an extra for free. You can pick up L28's for very little money - and it costs the same to overhaul either one. I do recommend keeping the original matching number L24 in your 240Z if you want to retain the highest resale value. If you don't care about that - and just want a nice engine with a little more power then start with an L28.

Fifth:

If the original engine is still in the car - I'd get it running first. Then determine what is actually needed. Might just need a fresh valve job. After you know - you can pull the engine and clean it up /detail it etc. May only need a new valve cover gasket, new pan gasket, front & rear main seals. With any care at all the L24's will easily run 150K miles without a major overhaul.

good luck with your project,

Carl B.

[Carl Beck]

To turn the cam with the head removed you can put a wrench on an area of the cam that has a couple of flats cast on it.

Of course you really would NOT want to do that - unless somehow you have a void below the combustion chambers - so the valves can be pushed Open, with out bending the valve stems!

FWIW,

Carl B.

[olzed]

Of course you really would NOT want to do that - unless somehow you have a void below the combustion chambers - so the valves can be pushed Open, with out bending the valve stems!

FWIW,

Carl B.

Yeh I'm assuming he would have figured that. It would be pretty hard to bend a valve by turning the cam by hand. But then I guess it depends on the size of the arm and the wrench . I have a 24inch that would do it. Wrench I mean.

Edited April 21, 2012 by olzed

[Jonu]

Hello Jonu

Welcome to the group. It would help if you gave us some idea as to what use you plan to put your 240Z to. Said another way - do you plan to actually "Restore" it, or just "Refresh" it, or do a complete Street Mod. to it. Once you start down any path - it can cost a lot of money to change your mind later.

it would also be helpful if we knew how much room you have to work on the car, how well equipped your Tool Box is etc. As well as what time frame you have in mind - is this a one year project or are you thinking of 90 days etc.?

If you want the best advice here - you have to provide the best possible information on your end.

First Read this thread: It will answer a lot of your initial questions

http://www.classiczcars.com/forums/showthread.php?22619-Waking-the-sleeping-beast

Second:

Read the information about the E31 and E88 L series heads here:

http://www.zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/E31andE88Heads.htm

If you actually have an E88 off a 260Z, you may not want to use it. Unless you plan extensive modifications for performance. The E88's that came on the 260Z's were "emissions" heads - not performance heads.

Third:

It would be a lot more useful if you can Post some clear detailed pictures of the car and its component parts. We would have to see things like the fuel lines, overall condition of the engine compartment etc - to really give you sound advice.

I've never had to replace the metal fuel lines on a 240Z - but then my Z's have always been in "low rust" States/Area's. If the car spent time in the Great Lakes Area of the Country or in the North East.. you may have major rust problems.

Fourth:

I can't see any reason to overhaul a non-matching number L24 - for a 240Z. Even if you got an extra for free. You can pick up L28's for very little money - and it costs the same to overhaul either one. I do recommend keeping the original matching number L24 in your 240Z if you want to retain the highest resale value. If you don't care about that - and just want a nice engine with a little more power then start with an L28.

Fifth:

If the original engine is still in the car - I'd get it running first. Then determine what is actually needed. Might just need a fresh valve job. After you know - you can pull the engine and clean it up /detail it etc. May only need a new valve cover gasket, new pan gasket, front & rear main seals. With any care at all the L24's will easily run 150K miles without a major overhaul.

good luck with your project,

Carl B.

Thanks for all the info. I've read through that Waking the sleeping beast and figure I'll start with those tips on Monday. My main goal is to get it restored to something similar to what a race prepped 240Z would have been like back in the 70's, So basically, my plan is to have it be a period correct race car (minus the modern safety equipment). I'm hoping to get an extra block that I can then get built up as an aggressive street/mild track engine. I would leave the original engine stock and just keep it in good running shape. While that's being done I just want to go through the car and take care of the little bits of rust it has and make sure the suspension is as good as possible. My plan is to use struts and springs since I don't want to cut up the shock towers for coilovers. As far as my planned changes goes it looks something like this:

1. Get the car running

2. Find a spare block (I don't want to screw up the original) for the fun engine. I've actually already located both an L24 and L28 block, I just need to figure out when and how to get it since my other car is a 370Z.

3. swap in a 4 speed manual

4. Struts and springs

5. New emblems to replace the missing or broken ones

6. Fresh paint, I want to keep the original factory blue paint.

There's obviously other things I want to do, but it falls under the normal wear and tear replacement items.

And for the other things you mentioned Carl, I have access to a fully equipped garage with lifts, air tools, torque wrenches, sand blasting cabinet (not very big though), etc. As for the time period, I would like to get it running asap; I'm not in a huge rush to get everything done and plan on taking my time doing this. Maybe a couple years would be a good estimate. I'll try to get some detailed pics up later today. I was taking pictures yesterday and left my camera at my friend's house when i showed him the pics. Finally this is what I do know about the car. The owner I bought the car from owned the car (well the title was in his name) since 1985. I'm not sure where it was before that but I know that for the time he owned it; it was located in El Paso Texas. The last time it was run was in 2007 when it got an inspection sticker. He only put 4 miles on the car after recieving the inspection. According to his friend who was selling it for him, the car hasn't really moved much in the last ten years. So going off the information I got, I assume that it was running before it started sitting and if the mileage on the odometer is actually correct, this car might only have 50k miles on it (which I find hard to believe); I'm thinking I might do a title search once I get my title in the mail and see what turns up. The only spot that has rusted through is the cowling, which i have found a replacement for, the rest appears to be surface rust. I looked under the car, in the wheel wells, under the footwell carpeting and didn't see any rust in those areas, which makes me think the car has been out here in the SW the whole time. I was told that the previous owner liked to keep it parked under a tree and that when his friend was asked to sell it there was a lot of crud on the cowling and hood. I'll be sure to get some pics up later today.

[Jonu]

Found a little project for today. I knew there was a rear window louvre in the back of the car. and the one that was installed was in fairly poor shape. So I pull out the box in the car and it was a brand new interpart louvre with everything still in the original packaging. The box looks old as dirt and is about to fall apart so i figured I'll get the new piece installed. I'll take some crappy before and after pics with my phone.

[tlorber]

I would pull apart all of the brakes and make sure they are in decent condition. Also, if you plan on putting in a manual, you might want to consider a 5 speed from a ZX. This will be better suited with a shorter differential (3.7 or 3.9) but if your car has an automatic it should be a 3.54 and that would work for a while.

Personally I'm not a huge fan of louvres, but to each his own.

[Carl Beck]

Hi Jonu:

Sounds like you are in very good shape all-around for the project you propose. Two years is also a good estimate - - as a lot of that time will be spend deciding on specific parts, or specific suppliers, or specific fabricators etc - - then locating them, then waiting for them to send your stuff of do their work.

Offhand - a couple of things you might want to consider:

I would suggest that you give some additional thought to using coil-overs. You don't have to modify the shock towers - any more than you would if you lowered the ride height with shorter springs, or shortened struts. The main advantage of coil-overs for your use - is that you have more room under the fenders for larger tires and you have lots of options related to spring rates and shocks. Not to mention an adjustable ride height.

Secondly if you haven't already - you can start looking for sources/prices on some "period correct race car parts" now - even if you are not ready to put stuff on the car. Shopping early gives you more time to compare options, prices and suppliers - - plus increases the efficiency of the process when you are working on the car. {also can save a lot of personal frustration}

I'll start the List - you and others can add to it:

- aluminum radiator & overflow can

- remote oil filter hardware and oil cooler

- Period correct S/W mechanical oil pressure, water temp, oil temp gauges if you go that way. Or the more modern digital stuff that will have the correct diameter to replace the OEM stuff..

- A good "local" source for A/N fittings and steel braided hose. You most likely won't want to buy all this stuff locally because of higher local prices - - - but it is good to know where you can get a few needed pieces in a hurry. {even if they are a bit more money}.

- Rebuilt 5 spd. & what ever matching rear-gears you want. Posi-unit ?

good luck,... keep us Posted...

Carl

[Jonu]

Pictures as promised, I'll try to get some better ones during the day tomorrow, I didn't get home from shooting until it was dark. I have planned on using some mechanical gauges. One of the things i did plan on using modern tech for is the ignition system. I've talked with MSD and think I have a setup figured out, but I'm wondering is there a way to convert to a modern distributor and get rid of the points or is it reliable enough when properly cared for?

Are you saying that either way I go I'll have to mess with the shock towers? If so, I'll just go ahead with the coilovers. I figured staying with springs and struts would prevent me from having to modify that.

And some pics from the other day sitting next to my 370: